All this talk by the GOP about banning contraception, particularly for poor women, has me a little bit confused. And for good reasons.
The first one is because I’m pretty sure that the poor and downtrodden aren’t really the GOP’s base. So why do they want more poor people?
Then there’s the money part of this question. Because, last I heard, Republicans are really big investors. Don’t Republicans invest in drug companies that sell contraceptives? You know, birth control? Products that keep people from having babies when they, umm, you know. Don’t Republicans want to make money from their investments?
But the third and most baffling reason I don’t understand their desire to prevent women, and particularly single women, from getting contraceptives — making it more likely they’ll have babies — is because of what single women can and have done:
From Dailykos.com
Politics is so gosh darn confusing.
FiftyFourandAHalf 
You keep doing it. You are a political genius. You should be a campaign manager or an anti-campaign manager.
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?
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Carolyn, I think that WordPress just put Lorre’s comment to me in with yours. WordPress messes with my comments from time to time.
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I couldn’t agree more. She should be managing a campaign. I’ve told her and told her and told her!! 🙂
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No, thanks. I don’t want to end up the subject of an HBO movie! You know, Dame Change.
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I’d be more likely to be an anti-campaign manager. Actually I like to do political phone calls — it’s great fun. I’ve already signed up for this season.
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Good luck to you on that quest. However, if you want to be successful, it is important to keep an open mind and question one’s own beliefs. Especially when one is very certain that they are right.
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and I suggest that you do that as well.
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Valentine, thank you for fighting the good fight. Carolyn, if this really was The Hunger Games, you would live in the Capital watching gleefully as another of those poor, sad, starving people (who bring it all on themselves, of course) bites the dust. I’ve never heard such insincere twaddle in the whole of my life. Sorry, Elyse. I will say no more! 🙂
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This is a truly heartfelt issue, so I understand your position completely.
Who would have thought that this brief (and I thought humorous) post would have unleashed such fury.
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I have come to a point in my life where all I want to do is learn, learn learn and I came here for that purpose looking for balanced and intellegent discussion. I shall take leave.
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The GOP is NOT trying to prevent anyone from obtaining or using birth control but ARE against having citizens pay for another’s birth control. Please, just go to the store, or your Drs. office….purchase birth control but do not ask ME to pay for it. I do not ask you to pay for mine.
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The GOP, by trying to pass the Blunt Amendment that would have allowed ANY employer to refuse to cover ANY medical expense for ANY “moral or religious” purpose, was trying to do just that. With their adamant opposition to healthcare reform of any type, they were trying to do just that.
Their War on Planned Parenthood — which DOES NOT provide abortions — will force women who can least afford it to pay for contraception pay for it. Alternatively, they will have more babies which they can afford less. And of course, the “safety net” these days amounts to a heating grate.
And what about use of contraceptives for other health issue — endometriosis, severe acne, or what I used them for, Ovarian cysts. This was the same condition that the woman Sandra Fluke was discussing need them for. It is not for rampant sex parties.
I am sick and tired of the hypocrites like Senator David Vitter (can you say prostitutes, David?) and Larry “Wide Stance” Craig trying to teach me about religion, family values and what I can and cannot do with my body.
The GOP is now trying to backtrack on all that they have done to tick off women like me. But they’ve lost us. The country will be better off for it.
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Planned Parenthood is the largest provider of abortions performing 332,778 in 2009. (Wikipedia)
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How about this, as a woman who works and pays taxes and pays for my own health insurance I want it to cover medical and pharma that would be standard for my needs. I pay for those things, they include Breast Cancer Screenings, annual pelvic exams, Birth Control (of my choosing) and when I am old enough to be concerned hormonal treatment to get me through those golden years of the change from fertility to infertility. Those are the normal things my insurance should cover because I am a woman who pays for out of my pocket healthcare insurance.
I don’t want you to pay for my insurance. Don’t need you to, my annual earnings are well into six figures.
I do, however want to ensure those who are not as fortunate as me have access to affordable birth control. The reason for this is it is far less costly to prevent pregnancy than it is to pay for pre-natal care and raising a child.
I suspect you have really been following some of what members of the GOP have been saying, many do indeed want to cut access to Birth Control, but then perhaps it is more convenient to believe otherwise.
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One would assume, that when people struggle it is beneficial for the the government to step in to assist (remember, this is with taxpayer’s money). It has been proven over and over that Americans who have been assisted do the worst long term.
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You have got to be kidding, right? Those who need our assistance should receive it because this is America and we are a land that looks after our own. I don’t know where you got that information, don’t know that I want to know either, but there is nothing, no statistics I have ever seen that would support your statement.
Poverty, by the way, is not a crime (yet) in this nation.
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I feel as sad for the poor person as you do and I give directly to them, frequently. I do feel, however, that many poor continue in that vein because of all the help. It becomes a habit. An expectation. A given. As an American I do not wish to do this to my fellow American. I want him/her to have the same opportunities as I.
Also, churches, family and neighbors need to do more. The government, less.
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Done with the discussion. I never continue a discussion where there is no underlying foundation in fact or a basis for a middle ground. Carolyn I hope you never find yourself in need of a hand up.
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This did not resemble a discussion. It was a rant.
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Carolyn,
I almost don’t know where to begin to rebut the things you said above. Like Valentine, I do hope that you never need a hand, or if you do, then you will remember the things you have written here, and no doubt said whenever anyone would listen. I imagine that one of the reason you feel compelled to comment on a blog like mine, which has a decidedly different frame of reference, is because either
(1) everyone you know thinks like you do; or
(2) you have run out of people who don’t agree and who are still willing to be polite.
I will continue to be polite, although I think the numerous things you say are sadly, anti-Christian, anti-American and would not result in you getting any humanitarian awards. I believe that you are kidding yourself to think that by spouting Republican talking points, by listening to Fox News, Limbaugh and Beck that that somehow gives your positions some sort of cover. It does not.
Because someone is poor is no reason to treat them poorly. It is no reason to deny them what our society, without government DOES NOT DO. Churches, charities, families and neighbors have fallen short, which is why the safety net was cast to begin with. But the GOP has decimated any hope that those who need a hand up can get enough of a boost to help themselves. I am speaking here of education — HEAD START has been cut drastically, repeatedly under the GOP. The GOP wages their first attacks on 5 year olds. Does that make you proud to be a Republican?
As for Planned Parenthood and the number you cited for their abortions, you are wrong. You misrepresented the facts when you posted the number of abortions you claimed Planned Parenthood performed. In fact, it provided ABORTION SERVICES to the 332,278 people you mentioned, which is completely different. It means COUNSELING. It is counseling that is given to both men and women. It includes information about safe abortion procedures as well as alternatives to abortion including adoption and prenatal care for those who make that decision. These counseling services represent only 3% of total Planned Parenthood expenditures.
When Title X, which originally authorized funding for Planned Parenthood was enacted in 1970, then-President Nixon described Title X funding as based on the premise that “no American woman should be denied access to family planning assistance because of her economic condition.”
It is a reprehensible situation when anyone harkens back to Richard Nixon as a moral leader.
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I am weary of being insulted but do want you to know that I do not watch television, am a Libertarian and I do not believe you will be inviting me to lunch any day soon!
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Valentine, I think I need to put you on retainer for when I am at work.
Carolyn, I too will respond to you later tonight, but I have dinner plans tonight so it will be late.
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You are correct. We were separated at birth.
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Glad I found you again!
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I know I’m late to the party, but I wasn’t sure I wanted to say this. Maybe I should. In the early 70s, I was a very young woman with a very big problem. Endometriosis. For the guys out there, just think of it as an invasive, very painful, sometimes deadly “ladies’ problem.” Mine was as bad as it gets. I depended on my doctor, a Catholic named Montello who knew how bad it was, but did not believe in contraceptives, to tell me how to proceed. I had surgery, which he performed, to remove an Ovarian cyst. At that time he cleared out the endometriosis and called it a day. After the surgery, he said he could prescribe “the pill” to keep the endometriosis from returning, but he didn’t believe in it. He said I was a young, as yet unmarried woman, and he thought it was wrong. I was so young and so traumatized at the time, that I simply said “okay,” having no idea what he was doing to me. I almost died. It was his partner who discovered two years later that Dr. Montello had deliberately chosen to take a chance with my future ability to have children and ultimately my life, all in the cause of his own religious freedom. Needless to say, I had to go through the surgery all over again and this time a complete hysterectomy was performed. There would be no kids for me because my doctor just didn’t believe in the use of contraceptives for any purpose. Well, those were the days. A lot of women just didn’t argue with authority figures like doctors or professors or whatnot. Today I sit her childless and alone and I think of Dr. Montello and I think of the debate that is raging in the media and on this very blog and I simply can’t believe it. Are enough people to elect a president still so stupid that they can actually believe that this is about religious freedom? The current battle cry of “Religious Freedom” in this country is nothing but a campaign ploy, a slogan to appeal to people who don’t understand the implications at all. It has nothing to do with religion or freedom. It has everything to do with setting back the rights of women at least 50 years.
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Wow. Thank you, Delajus, for sharing your sad and deeply personal story about this issue.
Nobody should be harmed for someone else’s religion, as you were. Isn’t that exactly what our forefathers came to America to escape? Isn’t that why the U.S. exists.
You are absolutely right; it has nothing to do with religion or freedom. And they are wrong and should be stopped.
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Yes, you’re right, but WHY? It doesn’t make sense. What is the upside of having lots of poor people. It’s something I will never understand.
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My guess is that Republicans want to make sure poor people stay poor. Lots of unwanted babies works towards that end.
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My apologies. I allowed myself to be sucked in and ranted. It has been a bad few days. I hope you will forgive me.
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No need, Valentine.
When I post a piece like this, I assume that folks are going to have opinion. I am perfectly happy to be a forum, as long as folks are nice and respectful. You were.
Me, I think that it is important to get both sides out — and I am proud that Peg spurred on such a heated discussion.
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Now more than ever, the GOP is not a unified front. A simple example is the difference between the two top contenders for the GOP presidential nomination. Rick Santorum is the champion of the far right social and religious conservative wing of the party, who are anti-contraception and anti-choice.
Romney panders to the same base for votes, by acting as if he supports their agenda – but his real political identity is with the economic wing of GOP, which is more dedicated to corporations and the wealthy by supporting free market capitalism with as little government regulation and corporate taxation as possible, and placing the heaviest proportion of the tax burden on the personal income of the middle class.
Romney said he was pro choice when he first ran for Governor of MA, then flip flopped when he decided to run for president.
Sooo… over on the GOP side right now, you have a choice between a far right wing religious fanatic who is anti-choice and anti-contraception, and a guy who will say anything to get votes, who’s real agenda is to put the interests of corporate and wealthy America ahead of the rest of us.
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Well, you can always vote for the Dems. That’s my plan. I don’t trust Santorum because I think he is nuts; and I don’t trust Romney because I’m never sure which way the wind is gonna blow.
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And “vote for the Dems” is what I’m hoping that a winning majority of Americans do in November. Santorum is nuts, and nobody’s really sure who Romney really is, except that he made it clear in his own words, that he believes that “Corporations are people…”
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That’s my hope too, Chris. And I’ll be working and donating to make it happen. And probably writing a bit. Thanks for your comments.
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We have a saying at work, “Don’t apply logic where there is none.” I think it works in this case too.
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Absolutely! Thanks Paprika!
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I haven’t looked at the demographics recently, but the last time I did, a surprising proportion of people in lower income categories vote Republican. I can’t quite figure out why, but they do.
It’s all very confusing–you got that right!
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It is confusing. But I think that a big part of it is that the GOP attracts the downtrodden who believe it is not their fault that they are who/what/where they are. They are looking for someone to blame. And these days, who better to blame than the black/Kenyan/not born in the US/Harvard Elitist ?
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Elyse, I’m probably going to be eaten alive here, but I’ve got to say you I don’t think you are getting good information on this. NOBODY in the Republican party is advocating banning birth control, Nobody is saying access should be limited. Nobody. Period.
This is a made-up issue to take people’s attention from what is going on. Like a magician getting you to look at his left hand while his right hand is moving the pea under the shells. Under Obamacare, the federal government is saying that ALL employers will have to PAY for sterilization, abortifacient drugs and contraceptives for their employees. Even if their religion says those things are wrong.
It doesn’t matter what you and I think about birth control. That’s not the point. We don’t get to judge whether or not somebody else’s religious beliefs are true or false; good or bad. We do need to respect them.
This is fundamentally a question of religious freedom in America and, frankly, that we have come to this point scares the hell out of me.
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pegoleg – would you extend that argument to statehouses passing more restrictive conditions on those seeking abortions?
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I believe most people would agree that abortion and birth control are not equivalent issues.
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That issue was already addressed and under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, religious institutions are now exempt from covering specific items (e.g. Birth Control, Abortion) within the medical insurance coverage they provide. This does not extend, nor should it, to every employer and certainly does not extend to necessary medical care or prescriptions for other medical needs. It does not extend to employers or other entities that are ‘for profit’ whether they are under an umbrella of a religious institution or not.
This is hardly a distraction. In fact there are several members of the far right within the GOP who are indeed advocating the banning of access to birth control, a woman’s right to choose, affordable health prenatal care, cancer screening and a host of other specific women’s health issues. All one needs to do is look at the variety of legislation offered up by all the Red states.
This is not fundamentally a right of religious freedom. This is fundamentally the right of woman in this nation retaining their full enfranchised as members of society, maintaining all the rights and privileges our mothers and grandmothers fought for and gained.
Religious freedom has never been under attack in this nation so long as that religion is Christianity it is safe. However, gender, race and sexual orientation continues to be under attack and it is up to those of us of good conscious to ensure we continue to fight for the rights and privileges of all members of society and not be distracted by the disingenuous cry of those who would demand their religious freedom at the expense all other members of society.
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I respectfully disagree with almost all of your assertions, but don’t want to go down the road of escalating political rhetoric – frankly, I see way too much of that on the interwebz.
Have a nice day! (backing slowly, carefully out of post…)
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Valentine, thanks. You made lots of good points. And I couldn’t make them earlier!
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Daniel, I am so impressed that you went into the lion’s den. You are a brave soul. But I think debate on both sides is important and good and I’m glad you commented, Peg. And while I disagree, while I think that you are incorrect, I am really glad you commented. And I’m sorry it took me so long to get back to my own party — it’s been a busy day.
With the introduction and debate on The Blunt Amendment, which I wrote about here: https://fiftyfourandahalf.com/2012/03/06/ the GOP decided to get all up in everyone’s face and cry “religious freedom” while attempting to deny freedom of choice for women. While attempting to deny women health care — because birth control pills are used for other things — I myself took them when I had an Ovarian cyst.
The Blunt Amendment would have allowed any employer to deny any employee coverage of any treatment based on moral or religious grounds. It was a slap in the face of hardworking Americans. And it is not just a women’s issue.
The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act and the implementing regulations provided, very recently, a mechanism for employers to opt out of paying for women’s needs, without actually denying them coverage. Now, I don’t know about you, but I know a bit about medicines, and a bit about how much they cost. The answer is, a lot.
I personally don’t think that any employer has the right to deny coverage, least of all religious groups. Where does it stop? An employer could object to paying for cancer treatment, because, well, if you’ve got cancer, it’s God’s will. There is no end to the possibilities. 99 percent of women use birth control; so I think that, if church organizations feel it is so sinful, well, they better address the sinners and not try to stick religion into my country’s government, into my Constitution. They are supposed to be separate. That’s how it’s drafted. I teach Civics. I understand this principle pretty well.
Besides, and here I am pointing directly to the Catholic Church, they need to get their own house in order. When they take care of the pedophiles and stop harboring them, stop protecting them, then they can perhaps offer an opinion on what women should do with their bodies. Until then, no.
It IS a debate about contraception. It IS a debate about abortion rights. It IS a debate about battles that are over, long over. It is a debate about whether we go forward or go backwards. The GOP, in my opinion wants us to go backwards. What’s next, voting rights?
Worse, in my opinion, is the attack on Planned Parenthood, which they ERRONEOUSLY claim is an abortion provider. Cutting and denying funding to Planned Parenthood has one result — more unwanted pregnancies. Period. And of course, the GOP is against paying to educate, feed, house the children who will be born into poverty.
Again, if they are willing to take care of the disadvantaged, well, then maybe I would be more forgiving. But they aren’t. They live in their houses, they build walls, they take advantage of government-sponsored healthcare that pays for contraception for their wives and their daughters (because these folks are mostly men, don’t cha know). And that healthcare will cover them until they die.
Peg, I believe that they are taking away so many rights and they are crying “FREEDOM” with each one they take. And I will do all I can to defeat them.
Thank you for bravely challenging what everyone else is thinking. You have a forum here whenever you want to argue about this or any other issue.
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Nuts! Where’s their head at?
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Actually I do believe that their heads can generally be found where they don’t belong. At least that’s what I see in all of the “family values” crowd in the US — they are always caught in the most compromising of positions.
Welcome back!
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No, it does NOT make sense. I’m with Valentine … Nothing that those folks have been saying makes any sense to me.
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My readers are very smart folks, even if they are confused.
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Nothing the GOP is talking about makes sense to me. Nothing.
Not the cultural issues of Contraceptive Access, Right to Choose, Women in society, Education, Economy….nothing.
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I agree. They take fanaticism to new heights. Constantly.
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Scratching my head in disbelief. I don’t get it either.
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Perhaps that is the key to the GOP success — they just confuse folks, chant their names again and again, and people vote for them.
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Politics has more and more toward instituting a preferred morality from those who know best for all. After all, just ask them and they will tell. Well done Elyse!
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Thanks Frank.
I am SO SICK OF THESE GUYS. It makes me crazy.
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I know what you mean … I surprise by taking them less serious than they think they are. The circus will be over soon … well, at lest until the cross-party battles ramp up to the next level.
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So agree with you and all the comments, especially momshieb’s comment that logic has no place here. Isn’t it logical, after all, that making access to contraception more difficult will result in more babies for lower income women, which would exponentially swell the welfare, medicaid and food assistance programs that the GOP wants to cut??
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Lisa, Lisa, Lisa. Not only is the whole thing illogical, but you KNOW, you just KNOW that they WON’T pay for any of the costs of these “former embryos” that they will force into the world. Churches do it all, don’t cha know?
Crazy stuff!
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Is it just me or do you fear your head might soon explode too?
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My head hurts.
Don’t you find it ironic that women only got the right to vote in 1918 but somehow we – who are paid less than our counterparts – are commandeering so much of the “debates” right now? Ugh.
Well done!
MJ
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MJ, you really need an aspirin :).
But I’m not sure we’re commandeering the debate — the controls that the GOP want to institute will certainly adversely impact women more so than men, no matter which end of the spectrum: take away birth control — more women with children will live in poverty. On the other end, more women will live in poverty at the end of their lives when they take away Medicare and Social Security.
What’s not to like about this GOP platform?
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I need a whole bottle … there isn’t one – from either side of the aisle – that I can get behind. Ugh!
MJ
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We’ve hit 7 billion people and the planet struggles to support who we have. Such a crazy scheme to forcibly populate more.
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And, of course, they won’t help pay for them, will refuse to pay taxes to educate them, give them healthcare, etc. etc. etc. Why do folks go along with this crap?
A commenter on Stuph Blog (http://stuphblog.wordpress.com/) a few weeks ago claimed that the planet can support, I think it was 360 billion people (I am not sure that that is the actual number she used, but it was many, many times the current population).
There are crazy people who believe stupid things. Like that Rick Santorum should be president of the US.
I’m getting madder and madder.
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360 billion?! I have a spare room but I don’t think that will help much 🙂
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Brilliant!
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Thanks, Renee. It’s a great poster, isn’t it?
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I absolutely love the poster! But I must remind you: logic has no place in this discussion. This is American Presidential politics, after all!
Expecting logic on this topic would be like expecting the Republicans to be in support of universal, mandated health insurance, an idea that they cooked up through the Heritage Foundation.
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Isn’t it a great poster? I wish I could have found the creator, but I could only acknowledge the website I got it from.
You’re right — this time more than usual there is no logic. And I keep looking for logic. That’s because, like you, I think about stuff and what the ramifications might be. Silly us.
But Mags says its just as bad where she is (except that their elections will be over next week). So where will we go when Rick Santorum wins??????
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“Where will we go”?
Maybe Iran, where the leadership is slightly less controlled by fanatical religious fervor?
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I’m not in America so I can’t even tell who this supposed to be supporting. This could be a poster for either side of the debate. I really can’t believe that contraception is actually being debated. It seems sort of barbaric. That is probably too blunt, but from the other side of the planet that is how it looks.
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Thank you for so clearly stating what those of us on this side of the planet are thinking! “Barbaric” indeed! Most of us can’t figure out if Rick Santorum et al have been in comas for the past 40 years or what. We thought the contraception issue was settled, for goodness sake!
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I feel so bad for folks who have to listen to this whole debate from afar.
“Hey, these folks with thousands of nukes want to turn back the clock to where they were prepared to use them — the Sixties!” I know I find that comforting.
Crazy people should not get the keys (or the codes).
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I can’t figure out Rick Santorum. He wants to get rid of birth control because that way everyone will be more responsible about sex. Huh? Oh yeah, he wants to ban pornography.
I think V neck sweaters are pornographic, so let’s get to bannin’.
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If we could just get people to take Santorum as a complete joke, we’d win. But alas he has a big following and it scares me. Hopefully he will be put in his place (the loony bin) and will not force Romney (who will get the nomination) to put another crazy on the ticket too.
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This one is an interesting post. You are too good with this one. 🙂
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Thanks Arindam! It is completely non-sensical.
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Hi,
That just seems ridiculous. So many unwanted children already in all parts of the world. I can see a not very pleasant future in this, just more and more street kids. 😦
Politics and certain policy’s are confusing the world over.
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You’re right Mags. Perhaps there is something in the water or the air that is making folks nuttier than usual.
I’ve never understood anyone one who disagrees with population control (i.e. BIRTH Control). Because you’re right — the outcome isn’t going to be a happier planet.
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You sure know how to get to the crux of a matter–brilliant!
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Thanks, Bella.
I love that poster!
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If you’re part of that crazed GOP fringe, seeing your photo of what single mothers can produce will give them a good argument against being a single mother. 🙂 But, for a sane, really liberal guy like me… I like the photo!
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I like the photo, too. If they had any sense at all, they want fewer single mothers. They are something, these GOP folks. But I disagree with you — Rick Santorum is way better than I would ever have guessed. And that is mainstreaming the fringe. Makes me consider mainlining!
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True, and most contraceptives a generic, anyway.
John Stewart hit the nail on the head when he suggested that we call the babies “former embryos” in order to get the GOP to care about them.
Thanks for stopping by!
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Brilliant, Elyse. Truly!
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Nah, I just liked the poster. But there was no credit for that at dailykos.com.
Thanks for visitin’.
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I think they’re making enough off of viagra to offset the contraception loss.
And no, they don’t want poor people. but they don’t care about babies either, after they’re born.
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Guap, my reply to you appears below Angie.
Word Press hates me and my comments. It keeps on messin with me!
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Personally, I think it’s just more of the same, without the veneer. They used to be more subtle. Of course, they used to be more liberal, too.
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Nothing the GOP is doing makes any sense to me. Their entire premise for this election appears to be attacking the constitution. They are spitting over multiple amendments with their “moral” crusades. It’s sickening to hear and see.
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This officially does NOT make sense to me.
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Good. I’m glad it’s not just me! Thanks for stopping by.
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